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Avoiding the Puddle Episode #5 featuring Geesemaster!

August 5, 2010

The Feng special episode! Today we bring onto the show, Geesemaster one of the only reputable Feng players in the US. Aris shoots the shit and gets down to business, and covers many many very technical aspects to the Feng character. Though before that, Aris and MYK cover some specific topics such as the newly announced Street Fighter X Tekken, Harada/Murray’s interview, and the tournament tip for this episode is on “sandbagging” and many forms that in comes in.

For any suggestions on topics you guys would like Aris and MYK to cover, send them to:





MP3 – 1:09:59 – 64.1 MB

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44 Comments leave one →
  1. Cyclone permalink
    August 5, 2010 4:34 pm

    New ep!

    Title needs changing though, this is ep 5 not ep 4 right?

  2. 725 permalink
    August 5, 2010 5:01 pm

    sloppy steve strats for the win!

  3. Yang permalink
    August 5, 2010 6:07 pm

    Always enjoy hearing your podcasts, Aris. All very informative stuff. Thanks for another good one.

  4. August 5, 2010 10:28 pm

    I’m so confused. How can you spend half a podcast talking about Feng and never mention u/f+2. Also how can say King who has the best hop kick in the game has one of the worst. So confused. Great episode though.

  5. aris permalink
    August 6, 2010 12:13 am

    Sorry, I did forget to talk about that very important move among many others. As i stated in the interview, Feng is one of those characters with TONS of good moves. Far too many to talk about in a 30 minute interview.

    Also, imo King’s hopkick is one of the worst in the game. It being a knee does not make up for the lack of range. AK’s, Bruce’s, and even Miguel’s (even though its -14) are far more useful. This is my opinion but it is debatable.

    Hope everyone likes this episode.

    • 725 permalink
      August 6, 2010 9:47 am

      what about the tech trap for the unblockable 2~1,2?

    • Tekkenlover permalink
      August 6, 2010 11:37 am

      Aris that was awsome very indepth analysis , are you gonna talk about other characters as well?

    • August 6, 2010 7:27 pm

      I’ll debate it with you another time. King’s hopkick does not have a short range. You’re being decieved by the animation.

      • August 6, 2010 7:43 pm

        If you want proof go start up any match you want. King’s hopkick hits from starting distance appart Bruces’s for example will just wiff. The testing we did was on Fallen Colony with Julia for reference.

        Character’s who’s i15 hopkicks hit from start distance:
        Miguel, King, Armor King, Lee, Paul(u/f+34), Julia

        Character’s who’s i15 hopkicks wiff at start distance:
        Bruce, Feng, Law, Lei, Roger Jr., Wang, Yoshimitsu, Leo, Paul(u/f+4), Kuma(u/f+4)

      • aris permalink
        August 6, 2010 10:16 pm

        Well, I have always gone by King players complaints. I dont play King myself. Even players in Japan complained that his old hopkick had longer range. Thanks for the testing info. Maybe more interesting tests would be punishing -15s.

  6. Ron permalink
    August 6, 2010 3:57 am

    hahah you really like that fast blast beats?

    great episode man and upload the new level up your game episode bitches

  7. StickitIn permalink
    August 6, 2010 7:06 am

    Unrelated to this podcast, but the iplaywinner featuring aris podcast. Specifically the “no darth vader or bullshit like them just to sell copies” comment.

    It’s complete bullshit to not accept characters like these. For one, you should be tolerant and open minded when it comes to characters unfamiliar or uncanonical. Developers do not just throw together a character for shits and giggles. They give them a movelist with their own animations, frame data, and properties. You should at the very least respect the time that went into making these special characters, let alone the licensing issues that went into making it possible in the first place. It’s a total disrespect to yourself and to the developers to blatantly disregard characters such as these just because of pure personal distaste. I have yet to read or hear any valid point as to why excluding cross franchise characters should be allowed. Why not let folks who might enjoy these characters have the freedom to choose whether or not to play these characters. What it really seems like is players such as Aris do not want their intelligence insulted and risk losing to such characters and being forced to learn a new match up. As I said, I really have yet to hear a valid argument to not allow such characters. Fucking assholes.

    Besides that, nice podcast.

    • Gieroadsteve permalink
      August 6, 2010 7:48 am

      So you would’nt mind Popeye and garfield in your Tekken.
      Fucking asshole.

      Besides that, nice troll.

      • 725 permalink
        August 6, 2010 9:46 am

        popeye w/ spinach power up in rage mode. OMG. garfield and lasagna power up.. hm.. this sounds more like a mvc game now…

      • YourAss permalink
        August 6, 2010 6:00 pm

        i definately would not mind any characters added to tekken. gon was cool. i wish they had more guest characters. as long as the character is not broken, i see absolutely nothing wrong.

        again aris, i would like you to provide a good reason for game makers to not include “gimmick” characters. the reason being is because i feel you are a very intelligent person, good common sense, and for me to totally disagree with you on this, i would like for you to provide some reasons as to why these characters should not be allowed. i would like to know what i might not be seeing or understanding here.

        thank you. you’re a bitch.

    • August 6, 2010 12:16 pm

      I never said they shouldn’t be allowed. I said they shouldn’t be thrown in long running fighting game franchises just for the sake of selling copies. Like i said before, make a great game and you wont need a gimmick like darth vader. I have limited respect for business decisions like these.

    • YourAss permalink
      August 6, 2010 9:30 pm

      My bad. Aris never did say they shouldn’t be allowed, my misunderstanding. I agree that nothing should be thrown in long running fighting games for the sake of selling copies. I do not agree that darth vader and other guest characters are only a gimmick to sell copies because these characters do not break a game. If they did break a game, then I can understand and also agree they should not be in any game unless they are meant to sell copies.

  8. MacGyver permalink
    August 6, 2010 7:14 am

    Nice to hear you liked windir aris =)

    • August 6, 2010 12:17 pm

      I have always been a windir fan. I already listen to almost everything on your list. Going to look into the local bands you mentioned though.

  9. Quadrupledragon permalink
    August 6, 2010 7:18 am

    Great stuff, I need to start playing Feng again.

    What song did you guys use for this podcast?

  10. Lingmassacre permalink
    August 6, 2010 12:10 pm

    Feng is a fun character. I agree that BT db escape is great for egging people to come in. It’s very common for Ling to use the same tactic. Some other tidbits that are nice with Feng…

    using snake dash to hide db+3 or d+2
    ff+2 tracks okay to one side, setup for b+1 if they run in on block
    db+2,2,1 to catch aggressive high pokes
    great long range tracking move df+3+4
    qcf +1 mixup with qcf~df hop kick
    Three throw mixup from backturned (obvious, but not covered in podcast)
    Using f+2 as a poke, or f+2, *delay* 1,2 ch hit confirm
    d+1+2,1 against the wall to hit confirm a wall splat
    f+1,2,2… I still don’t know how to use that move well…
    b!, db+1,2 has one of the weirdest spikes.

    I did like the BT crouching idea for BT d+3. Totally stolen.

    He’s a fun character. I like him, but I’m no Feng expert. I just could never figure out how to stop range 0 pitbull.

    • August 7, 2010 5:04 am

      nice post LM
      sandbagging +1

    • LOC permalink
      August 18, 2010 12:58 pm


      BT crouch for an off-beat BT d+3 is SNEAKY SHIT
      Something I learned recently from Yuu, by way of Mirai’s cell phone…

      Oh, and the real reason that d/b+2,2,1 is useful even on regular hit is because it cannot be low-parried. I use it sometimes for a shot at B! near the wall.

      I think it should be mentioned that feng does get more damage at the wall on a direct wall splat after b1+2.
      SSL f+4,3 b+3,3 f+2,1,2

  11. Monte permalink
    August 6, 2010 7:39 pm

    was just gonna come on here and say good shit Aris and I really enjoy the podcast even though I don’t play Tekken but I do have one question now that I’ve listened to the episode that maybe you can answer next time on the podcast. when talking to geesemaster you were talking about some sort of 50/50 mixup and geesemaster had dismissed it because the step kick would take too long and you can see it come out. you then replied that geesemaster must be the greatest player in the world to be able to react to that because it was like a 14 or 16 frame move. what about tekken’s engine makes such a move so difficult to react to? coming from a SF background a 14 frame move would be considered very slow

    • aris permalink
      August 6, 2010 10:25 pm

      This an interesting question. I’ll do some research and try to answer it in the next podcast. Generally speaking around i18 is where visually seeing and blocking lows vs mids becomes very difficult in Tekken. My guess is the reason it seems very slow in SF terms probably has to do with the nature of the safety of holding db combined with the extremely small number of over heads. There being a third dimension probably makes defending more difficult as well.

      I think it would be more comparable to triangle jump mix ups with magneto. Though that is still much faster.

      • Derrick permalink
        August 9, 2010 5:06 pm

        I think that it might also be due to the fact that many moves in Tekken have similar looking startups and so while a move might be 18 frames, you may recognize the first few frames as another move. Maybe this is less of a factor in games with fewer moves.

  12. August 6, 2010 7:47 pm

    Frames are doubled in SF. The move really isn’t i14 it’s really i28 in SF. All SF frame data is cut in half for some reason. I think it was because in the past the games used to run at 30 FPS and now SFIV runs at 60FPS so as to not make the numbers so big and confusing they just release them as half of what they are.

    Also remember most self-camcord devices only recored at a max of 30 FPS so even if the game is running at 60 FPS it will seem like 30 when frame counted on a camcorder.

    • Monte permalink
      August 9, 2010 12:23 am

      i see, that makes sense. combined with the fact that fighting on a 3d plane can complicate things i can see why it would be considered fast. thanks for the answer aris and zero.

  13. Yoshimattsu permalink
    August 7, 2010 9:41 am

    Great Podcast!! I love hearing what you guys have to say, and people respect it, which is why I think you should do a bottom tier character episode.. You could talk about what makes them weaker, what pros do to overcome these handicaps, and what could be done to remedy these issues in the next installment.. I know Aris has said before that he generally likes lower tier characters, so his input would be killer, as I am a Yoshi player, and think he could use a spotlight on him and his move properties before the next Tekken.

  14. Forest permalink
    August 7, 2010 8:33 pm

    i think that Feng’s UF+4 is just fine. It might not reach from the moment the announcer says, “Fight!” at the start of a ound, but it is good and gets the job done. Especially, like Aris mentioned, Feng is a complex character to use and UF+4 is nice an simple to use.

  15. kuma permalink
    August 9, 2010 3:12 pm

    ive seen rains bruce catch hao forward 4 in the season 4 royal rumble

  16. Exfoliate permalink
    August 10, 2010 9:36 am

    Props to Aris and MYK on a very entertaining series. Get Kane on the show!


    • Aris permalink
      August 10, 2010 10:43 am

      If we do that, it will no longer be an entertaining series.

      • Quadrupledragon permalink
        August 10, 2010 10:35 pm


  17. AAK permalink
    August 10, 2010 9:23 pm

    Great episode, but it was a little too abrupt where you went straight to the Feng business the minute Geesemaster came on. I think it should be customary where the you should introduce the guests of the podcasts about how they got to their character and Tekken, how their local scene is, where there nickname comes from, and have their input on the things discussed with MYK in the first part of the podcast (like sandbagging). But it’s cool if you disagree.

    I still thoroughly entertaining episode as always. I looked but I couldn’t find the Jinkid vs Aris match :p

    • Inserity permalink
      August 12, 2010 11:22 am

      I think Aris was so excited to talk about Feng, that he forgot about the person he was interviewing lol.

  18. August 13, 2010 8:45 am

    Yeah so we’re here in Japan busy checking out the arcade scene and we’re hearing Yuu as the Japanese champ with his Feng. Mon and Shyft are showing us around here, seeing WCMaxi tomorrow night for dinner if we’re lucky and he’s not busy.
    Mon linked me to a few matches of Aris vs Yuu, I see where the interest is building.

    Everything Aris says about the Arcades here is spot on – even the fucking smallest back street arcades have the BigScreens with the Replays and the PhoneBooks with all the moves in them and all that shit. The IPW podcast mentions it… that was a good cast too.

    Here’s a vid of the Takadanobaba’s local arcade with all the stuff around and one of our less experienced players trying his hand on the sticks that he’s not used to.

    Then we went to the GAME arcade that hosted SBO in Akihabara at some point or something and it was the same thing just with 8 back to back machines –

    Yeah Japan’s not playing games, the food and woman are waaay too tier here too – it is a little expensive though, but then so are most places compared to South Africa – lol

    cool cool

    • August 13, 2010 11:26 am

      Cool video. Ill be going back in mid september. Cant wait.

      • August 13, 2010 9:28 pm

        Awesome. I hope you’re making Feng punishment vids and shit for your next Yuu match ups.
        Right now it’s ‘Obon’ which is a period where the Japanese ancestors are said to return home to see what the new generation are up to – as a result, many players are heading to family gatherings and festivals. This in turn means some of the arcades are pretty quiet right now. We went to JoyBox a day or two ago and there wasn’t a single player there. We then headed off to Kabukicho and the Arcade there was busy – but it was pretty random. Mon and Shyft are saying all the big names are gathering at Shibuya lately and that they have gone off JoyBox for a bit – apparently too many noobs rock up to try and learn from them and it interupts their sessions.

        Yeah man, I’m sure you’ll enjoy the shit out of September, good stuff.

  19. Neels permalink
    August 17, 2010 3:39 pm

    I was also surprised there was no discussion on u/f+2. Isn’t this one of the best evasive moves in the game? What about mixing it in from snakedash from the 1p side and how just how difficult is it to punish? Also a lot of talk of BT setups but what about BT throws? Aren’t throws from BT faster and therefore you don’t have time to react to the position of the arms?

  20. Neels permalink
    August 18, 2010 8:17 am

    In fact the the animation is the same for both throws from BT.

  21. August 23, 2010 6:39 pm

    Just if anyone’s interested I made a Japan Movie about what we got up to on that side –
    The place we stayed, some of the arcades, what we ate, good places to visit, the streets of Shinjuku and Akihabara x n –

    It’s mostly jokes, but some have found it pretty entertaining… lol

    Japan Movie Prt1

    Japan Movie Prt2


  1. Avoiding The Puddle Episode 5! « SDTEKKEN.COM – Tekken News Resource!

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